Xojo sometimes feels like a badly managed GitHub project and I’m not doing GitHub justice here as some projects do it very well on there. But man, where is the planning and organization within Xojo Inc?
They work like a bunch of guys spinning some ideas around and whatever and whenever something comes out is fine. Restarting Android from scratch 3 times? Go for it man, it’s not like we have clients waiting for stuff! Amateurs at best…
One of the key problems that I’ve noticed is that each time Geoff rolls out something ‘big’ there’s no community involvement or none that I’ve seen. It’s here it is, good luck.
You’d think with all these false starts, Geoff would get acceptance FIRST…
…
Maybe is a lesson learned. The web2 was in prerelease like a month and was a complete joke. I send lots of feed back with the most basic functionaliti of controls not even working. That time they fix a lot of them but still, release it.
1 year in prerelease and Web2 could be at least half baked 
Hopefully. Declaring something ‘pre-release’ that obviously does not have the required maturity and leaving it in this state, not retracting it, reveals a lack of proper process and a love for the cliffhanger marketing stunt. Not serious.
It’s very unlikely any lessons have been learned based on Geoffs posts on TOF.
That’s why I am using CodenameOne. Android and IOS and that’s it. Get the Job done. Development under Linux, Windows, MACOS with comfortable Build Servers. Just with Certificate Generators and with all you need around. That’s what makes mobile Development simple and fast. And that’s my Reason why I am developing Web Applications with Vaadin and sometimes with JavaFX. While I want to get the Job done and the Webapps has to be secure and working. And that I can have with Vaadin with Server based frontend and with Hilla with a Javascript based frontend. And at the end with Java Swing for Desktop Development while it makes cross platform Design really simple. One click away from binary packages with Github Actions. One IDE, one Language, one Codebase. Even when and if I ant the CodenameOne App running on Desktop: start the Jar generated locally. Package as binary. Deploy. Get the Job done. I am really starting to be out of the why and willtryresbttryagain system of the Xojo environment where I have every now and then to rewrite my stuffs from month to month while something is changed instead of having sustainable long term releases to rely on without any problem and no need for critical workarounds. Having all chances for Office automation, Charts, Graphics, Databases, short: all you need and what Xojo promises but without opening hundreds and hundreds of Bucks for Plugins. That is not acceptable at all. Xojo is a closed world. Sadly it is developing in the totally wrong direction. IO begged for another release system. I showed up alternatives. Then and before a few days. Simple alternatives usable for the Customers and reachable for the performance of the Team. Listening to the users is the key for getting to the right point. But the stiffness of their Ideas of leadership makes it impossible to do that kind of changes. And that is sad. Let’s imagine: two typed of Web projects would give the chance to modernize the security of Web 1.0 and develop the Web 2.0 to a really performant system without any pressure. That as long term release with only Bug fixes for 5 y<ears. Brilliant. And then the further stuff with new functionality as releases between. When a Release is half way stable…mark it as stable and the others: mark as Development. When a Development version in use shows up: works stable: new minor release and that makes it possible to say for example: 2022R6.16 stable after 2022R1.15 development and everybody can see: okay here I can do development with a stable release but I have to know: I use the newest features but frameworks can change.
One year before the next its comes people can start to rewrite the Stuffs they need to migrate. Then new feature stops to the stable brand should be named: lts candidate. So there is no feature change no framework change only Bugfixes for one year resulting in a stable version. And less bugs. Less work. And all new features.
Xojo likes to promise big, BIG things. But when those big things are late, buggy or canceled they like to try and shield themselves as just a poor little company, irregardless of the fact that you spent money/time/resources based on those promises. I would think the disparity between promises and deliverables would become less profitable over time, but maybe they can keep enough paying customers to believe the promises.
yes they have always played both sides
we’re big enough to take on these big jobs in a way no one can !
or
oh we cant do everything we’re just a little company with limited resources
always have
I guess they simply can not afford to hire more devs. The ‘Xojo is adequately staffed’ story is complete nonsense.
They may make new people buy a license once but renewals are unlikely. Long time customers leave. The find-new-customers wheel is spinning faster and faster. And Xojo being a low-code platform is just ridiculous.
All of that is coupled to a release System which is wrong. Instead of the testers version which costs the same amount of work then doing the testers version as development branch with new features they simply could set it as development version which can get from time to time in a stable moment the marker “stable”. And a year before the its Version is passing away they start to freeze that as new “lts-candidate” and do only bugfixes for it. Then they have all the chances to have 5 years LTS for the professional developers and also a development version which is feature growing. Less work and less terror than they have now while they get the versions stable and reliable. So they can fix framework based the bugs and having in the LTS branch and the new technology branch the chance to fix old bugs and build new features on a stable base. That’s how it is going. So JavaFX (and that beast is much bigger than Xojo as a project), Gluon Mobile and many other projects in market. I can’t get why they do not that simple step. So they hold the Pro’s while the busgfixes going into the LTS and they hold the interested for new features and also they get to the point that the stuffs are becoming more stable.
But that is not Xojo’s policy why ever.
I cannot imagine the attrition rate is any lower than it ever was
If you’re a Windows user WHY would you renew ?
For may years almost nothing changed
There have been minor updates & tweaks but no wholesale changes like they need to newer WinUI controls
Yet - its supposedly in the works but if its on an Android time scale it wont be released any time soon
For Mac users it s been more update if / when you update the OS mostly because Apple keeps breaking things that break Xojo and apps it produces Folks are still having issues with Ventura despite a release by Xojo to deal with issues
I dont know if they now ask people whose renewal date goes by why they haven’t / didnt renew. Or if they even track and report on that in any way
But finding new customers all the time is THE most expensive way to do business
Being Xojo, I expect this as another WEB2 fiasco, Not really what people want and no way to keep using current controls 
I really need to add the shrug emoji to reactions 
Just read the article Torsten posted in User-centric product development strategy - analysis of different approaches
It fits pretty well
Alain has offered a masterclass in understanding Xojo culture. Truth bombs wrapped in comedy gold. Instant classic!
“It is ready, when you will be gone” is the API2-version of the old “It’s ready, when it’s ready”
I prefer “its ready when its ready” instead of “we’ll ship it. soon.” which often meant “before it’s ready”
No wine before its time !
They haven’t asked me why I haven’t renewed in over two years, despite my having been named the third “highest-quality forum user” 
at the conference. FWIW, the reasons are
a) I’m afraid it’ll break my code or force me to learn new stuff
b) They refuse to fix stupid stuff in the IDE like the Inspector constantly re-opening itself, Code Assist or whatever it’s called not updating as you type, and method signatures displayed in a 5-pixel-wide textfield, despite Geoff’s having told me to my face in a video chat two years ago that it would all be rectified “soon”.
Geoff loves to say things “on the phone”.
plausible deniability since its your word vs his
tell him you’re recording the calls and see how things go 