I was half expecting that response, but no.
Embarcadero’s pricing is orders of magnitude higher.
We are talking thousands, not hundreds.
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If you have the time to invest for coding instead of having a working ecosystem. If not you may suffer from this.
well Xojo Pro costs 1.000,- USD now and everybody knows, without plugins from Björn or Christian or AppWrapper its quite useless, so add another 500-600 bucks on top. The Price Tag back in those time for Delphi was 1700,- EUR as far as I remember, no addons needed cause the VCL was quite complete.
Does not sound very far away to me.
Beside the fact that it is more expensive today it is no difference. Even Delphi is more or less dead. There is not so much change in functionality there and solutions are often half baked. But not even a bit in that wise Xojo is doing it. I don’t know how many users they still have but at the end it is no question: people are jack-assed.
If I have learned one thing within the time beginning in 1987 with my company then it is that a dead language makes no sense. I had this with TurboPascal. I decided in the late 90th to switch to Java and C++. And I was never regretting this decision. Not one moment in my life while at the end: ecerything is working And while Bugs are in 99% oif the cases my own fault. And not the fault of a bad programmed language
This is what I entered in ChatGPT and the result:
My prompt:
Is Xojo as bad as many people claim?
ChatGPT said:
Ah, the ol’ Xojo question — cue the dramatic music 
Let’s dive into the truth, no sugar-coating, just straight-up facts and balanced insight.
TL;DR:
Xojo isn’t “bad” — but it’s a niche tool with some serious trade-offs. It’s great for certain use cases (like cross-platform desktop apps for small businesses or internal tools), but falls short in areas where power, scalability, or cutting-edge modern features are needed.
The Good (a.k.a. “Why people use Xojo anyway”)
Easy Learning Curve:
If you’ve ever touched Visual Basic, Xojo feels like its spiritual cousin. It’s very approachable for non-programmers, hobbyists, and solo devs.
Cross-Platform Compilation:
Write once, compile for Windows, macOS, Linux, iOS, and even Raspberry Pi. For small apps, this is honestly pretty sweet.
GUI Builder:
The drag-and-drop interface builder is intuitive and fast. If you want a working UI in 10 minutes, you got it.
Built-in Database Support:
SQLite is first-class, and connecting to other DBs like MySQL or PostgreSQL is fairly easy.
Friendly IDE:
It’s clean, not intimidating. You can build an app in an afternoon.
The Bad (a.k.a. “Why people rage-quit Xojo”)
Proprietary Lock-in:
The compiler, language, and framework are closed-source. If Xojo ever shuts down or pivots (again), your app could be trapped.
Slow Development:
Many users complain that bugs go unfixed for years, and new features come at a glacial pace. Forums are filled with frustration on this.
Not Truly Cross-Platform:
Yes, it compiles across platforms, but the UIs often look weird on non-native platforms, and platform-specific quirks abound.
Performance:
Xojo apps can feel sluggish compared to apps written in native frameworks (like Swift, C#, or even Electron in some cases). It's not built for performance-heavy tasks.
Mobile & Web Are Weak:
The iOS support is half-baked, and Web apps are… well… let’s just say they lack the modern polish most people expect.
Expensive Licensing:
You pay for each platform separately unless you go all-in on the “Pro” or “Pro Plus” plan, and it’s not exactly cheap.
Why the Internet Hate?
Disillusioned long-time users: Many were loyal fans for years but grew frustrated as the product stagnated.
Comparison to Modern Stacks: In the age of Flutter, Electron, and web-first tools like React, Xojo can feel outdated.
Lack of Open Source or Ecosystem: You’re very much on your own — limited third-party plugins, tiny community, no GitHub goldmine to rely on.
So Who Should Use Xojo?
Solopreneurs or small teams making internal tools
People porting old VB6 apps to modern OSes
Developers who want native-looking GUIs without wrestling C++, Qt, or Swift
Folks building small utilities with minimal web/cloud integrations
Final Verdict
Xojo is not bad — it’s just outdated, overpriced, and underpowered for modern professional use.
But for small, internal, cross-platform desktop apps built by non-coders or solo developers? It still has its place.
Just… don’t bet your entire business on it. 
If you’re already familiar with PureBasic (which you are 
), Xojo feels bloated and limiting by comparison, unless you really need drag-and-drop GUI building with minimal setup.
Want to know how it stacks up against something like PureBasic, Free Pascal/Lazarus, or Electron for your project? I can do a tailored comparison too.
You said:
Yes please
ChatGPT said:
Aww yeah, let’s go full nerd mode, Chris 
Time to compare Xojo vs PureBasic vs Free Pascal/Lazarus vs Electron—with a laser focus on your needs as a business-savvy creator building real tools (like your bookkeeping app, dog tracker, and admin panels) with serious usability, longevity, and control.
Your Situation Summary
You want to:
Build desktop apps with GUI (dog tracker, bookkeeping)
Have full control (no web dependency)
Avoid slow performance
Possibly publish tools later
Keep costs low or reasonable
Maintain long-term stability and portability
THE SHOWDOWN
Feature / Tool Xojo PureBasic Free Pascal / Lazarus Electron
IDE & GUI Builder Very user-friendly drag/drop GUI Manual coding or include GUI designer Full-featured Delphi-like GUI builder Use HTML/CSS/JS, no native GUI builder
Cross-Platform Yes, but quirks & $$$ licensing Yes (Win, Linux, Mac) Yes (Win, Linux, Mac) Yes, but heavyweight
Cost $$$ (split licensing) 
One-time, cheap license (€79) Free & open source 
Free (but dev cost hidden in JS time)
Performance Mediocre Fast, small footprint Fast, compiled apps Slow, memory-hungry
App Size Small-ish, but larger than PureBasic Tiny EXEs (can be under 1MB) Medium-sized, but native code Huge (>100MB with Node.js runtime)
Extensibility Limited plugins, small ecosystem Small but solid native support Massive ecosystem, C libs supported Massive JS ecosystem
Learning Curve Low Low to medium Medium Medium-high (need JS, HTML, CSS)
Bugs/Support Often slow response from Xojo devs Small team but good updates Very active dev community Giant community, tons of StackOverflow
Docs / Tutorials Decent, but fragmented Clean and concise Tons of docs and legacy content Endless docs — if you can survive the maze
Web/Mobile iOS only (limited), Web 2.0 (basic) Web possible via CGI (primitive) Not ideal for web Web-native, and can be packaged
Open Source 
No No (but fully offline & yours) 
100% Open Source Open Source base
How It Stacks Up For You, Chris:
Criteria Best Choice Notes
Offline Desktop Tools 
PureBasic Tiny, fast, full control. Great for your dog tracker & Bala Bala Books.
Need Drag-and-Drop GUI Fast Lazarus/Xojo Lazarus is free. Xojo is easier but costs more.
Modern-Looking UI Electron or Lazarus Electron looks slick, Lazarus can be styled. PureBasic feels “classic.”
Publishing Portable Tools PureBasic No dependencies, single EXE dream. Low support cost.
Web GUI/Cloud Apps Electron or Real Web Dev (React/Vue) PureBasic/Xojo not built for it.
Long-Term Freedom Lazarus Open source and future-proof. No vendor lock-in.
Mobile Apps Flutter or React Native Xojo’s iOS is very limited. PureBasic = desktop only.
My Honest Recommendation
🧱 For your local tools, admin panels, dog medication tracker, hydro admin app, and Bala Bala Books:
➤ Use PureBasic. It gives you the most control, smallest footprint, full power, and no bloat. You're already comfy with it. It’s your Excalibur.
🧪 For GUI prototyping or fancy cross-platform tools with a bigger UI design need:
➤ Try Lazarus. Free, reliable, and more feature-rich GUI design than PureBasic.
🚫 Avoid Xojo unless...
You fall in love with the IDE and don’t mind the pricing/licensing. But honestly, you’d be tying your future to a niche, closed platform with slow updates.
💥 Avoid Electron for now, unless you're building something for the web, and you're happy dealing with JavaScript, updates, npm chaos, and fat installers.
My Personal Stack Pick For You:
PureBasic for all core logic
- (optional) Lazarus if you want GUI polish & visual drag-drop
- HTML/CSS for documentation/help systems (served locally)
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15 posts were split to a new topic: OO or Procedural?
App Wrapper is not needed:
So I’ve been using RB/Xojo since 2005. I’m definitely a citizen programmer. I’ve written tons of apps to automate much of job as a system admin. I write spaghetti code, start all app creation with a GUI, and don’t really need any cutting edge features. Now I’m retired, so I code for hobby and fun. Aside from SQLite, my needs aren’t larger and I’m not looking to land a job.
I own a copy of XOJO 2024 Pro. But I can’t justify $999 to renew. My next purchase was going to be the lite Xojo version for Windows (in a year or more). I’m wondering if VB.net is worth learning for my use case?
I’d consider looking into TwinBasic
VB.Net just isnt getting any of the newer .Net features added to it any more which is too bad
So while its still OK to write it may be on life support (?)
There are some others like PureBasic that, depending on your needs, you might consider
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Noooo. If you want .Net, use C## VB.NET is nothing like vb clasic.
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Microsoft put VB.Net on ice years ago. It is, at best “compatible” vice “supported” with rising .Net GUI options such as Avalonia.
RemObjects offers Mercury, which is VB. Net compatible. Not sure how much uptake it has had; the forum is pretty quiet. Still, looks like the annual license is now cheaper than Xojo Pro, and I expect it benefits from the stability and growth of the whole .Net ecosystem.
If you don’t mind leaving OOP, PureBasic is the way to go for a hobbyist.
Just as I’d nearly finished writing my article on how to do it with App Wrapper. At least there’s now more than one solution, so people don’t have to spend $1,000 on Xojo just to make their apps compatible with Tahoe.
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I do like c# quite a bit
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Frankly, Xojo for Windows 2024 should be capable of creating Windows apps for the next 10 years without upgrading. If you’re retired, you probably never need to change.
(You could probably still be using RB if it wasn’t for changes around Windows 7 onwards. Windows is much more backwards compatible than MacOS, where Apple seem to delight in breaking things every couple of years )
If you build for Mac, the situation is different - at some point in the next few years MacOS will probably demand some changes, and a Xojo Mac Lite/desktop might have been useful then.
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Go for C# if you want to go the .NET route. VB on .NET is stagnant and as per official MS announcement it will not be updated to the level C# is getting updated.
If you want a powerful and evolving VB like language check out Mercury. Its pricing
is also quite reasonable.
Otherwise learn and use FPC with Laz or Code Typhon.
My personal favorite is WinDev. It is not VB like but similar and it does reduce my development time by many folds.
Hehe for those still hanging on VB6 
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I shall definitely be reading that, my friend.
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Actually an RB 2007 single file exe still runs on the latest windows 11. Maybe earlier ones too but 2007 is the one I can test.
My last PRO license is 2018, still mantaining Web1 and Windows proyects
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FYI… Apple has already announced that all App Store Submissions after April 2026 MUST be compiled using the Xcode26 API. So Xojo needs to get off their butts.. (like that will ever happen)
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WOW 