Actually I think he does… or at least the majority of the user base that is actually attempting to USE this product… “Personal Bugs” are only part of the problem. In emails, feedback, and various public and private forums, 100’s of issues have been described, duplicated and then IGNORED… So when Geoff is asking for “specific issues”… he is just being an ass, and attempting to rationalize his behaviour. (And NO, I won’t apologize for calling him an ass)
And lack of manpower is NOT an excuse. Xojo has “marketed” a product, and than has LIED to the world about the state and status of said product.
In MY opinion they have violated at least THREE sections of the Consumer Advertising Laws in the State of Texas… Not to mention possible violations of the GDPR agreement between the United States and the European Union.
I’m commenting here on a post (The Feedback Points System) of Jason_Cox on TOF because of the sh*tstorm and accusation of blasphemy I would get there…
To be honest, I really, really doubt this number. Maybe if you add up all licenses (RB+RS+Xojo) ever sold plus the renewals (so counting a lot of the same users multiple times!) over 22 years and not subtracting the many who have left, you can get such a number. I myself am probably counted 5+ times, although I don’t even use it anymore.
But it can’t be anywhere near the number of currently active users, looking at the number of forum users (they once said 10%?), the lack of social media/blogging covering Xojo and even the relatively low number of results one gets when googling for Xojo.
So with the more realistic active users number in mind, his idea is not so far fetched and probably doable.
Do the maths. They have 5 full time engineers. Let’s say they’re on $100,000 pa. they’ve got two PR staff, let’s say $75,0000 pa and two other QA staff, let’s say another $75,000 pa. factor in an additional 20% for pensions and other staff related costs and that’s $960,000 pa. Lord knows what Geoff pays himself but let’s say it’s a sizeable $250,000 pa. that comes to $1,210,000 per year. They’d need about 4000 desktop users annually to cover that.
If Geoff has 400,000 users paying him $299 per annum a piece then that would be $120,000,000 per year. If that’s the case, why the f**k don’t they hire another engineer or 20?
I wouldn’t be surprised if the figures were more like half those salaries.
But equally, there aren’t 400,000 users paying $299 per annum.
I doubt 400,000 users per year, I doubt they all renew annually, and I expect many go for the $99 options.
400,000? It is possible if we count from the beginning of the company. Many years ago (2007?), REAL sold to the Ministry of Education and Science on Poland licenses for 60,000 students of high schools. Maybe they had more such contracts? Many moons ago REALbasic standard for Linux was free, that users count too.
I’ve only ever taken pro licences with various names and under many companies accounts over the years and have never been discounted (my fault for not seeking it), usually I was always current in one form or another. But since 2017r3 I have let it lapse (Xojo, not plugins) because for us, each consecutive release got worse and worse and was stuffed to the gills with features that flat out did not work correctly or that dedicated third parties could have done better.
I think using MBS is a solid data point for some estimation as most who are using this tool full time or for professional applications will be needing to also take MBS in some form or another.
Sorry but when I read your posts I too find them to be overly aggressive.
You DO NOT speak for the vast majority of the user base - that you feel so self important that you, and others on here, continually believe you are representative of the entire user base speaks volumes to how deluded you all are.
The vast majority are more than happy with the Xojo product - is it perfect? No but it’s still the best cross platform tool on the market. If it fucks you all off so much just leave and take your anger and ill judged self importance elsewhere.
Stop whining like little babies and make the change to another toolset. We will all be better off for it.
I skipped Xojo from banning me by banning myself. I just dont go there anymore. And its all around the drama. I am striving for a drama free life (and yes I know that is impossible). but I am working at getting as close as possible.
And the drama I am talking about is not one-sided or from a certain group of people. in general there is too much rage/anger/dishonesty there for me to spend any time there.
DaveK… I just happen to agree 100% with his comments, as do many other members of this forum… and therefore submit to you, that if you dislike our “whining” , which many of us see as attempts to make Xojo BETTER (despite the ego and arrogance of their management)… That YOU disengage yourself from THIS forum, so as not to be subjected to our tirades… Sorry, but Kool-aid is NOT the beverage of choice here.
that you feel so self important that you, and others on here, continually believe you are representative of the entire user base speaks volumes to how deluded you all are.
I’m getting used to Ad hominem
The vast majority are more than happy with the Xojo product
“Well, that’s just like your opinion man”. Observation does not support this.
If it fucks you all off so much just leave and take your anger and ill judged self importance elsewhere.
MVP candidate perhaps? Being an ass kisser only serves to further the company’s bad behavior.
Stop whining like little babies and make the change to another toolset. We will all be better off for it.
Everybody will benefit when the bug releases begin to drop on a regular basis. Normal dialog, the diplomatic approach and even mild hostility have not changed the status quo in many years, so if this product continues to slide into mediocrity, obsolescence and obscurity due to mismanagement and refusal to take quality control seriously, what have you got to loose in pushing the throttles to the stops?
I understand that just submitting, prostrating and being passively agreeable are all low effort, low energy positions that means you don’t have to act. So please continue to do so, please ignore those who are willing to push for change, if we win, you will benefit in any event.
I agree with this, and in my opinion the agressive tone harms the cause.
I wouldn’t know that. Where did you get the information to support that statement?
In my opinion the vast majority don’t voice their opinion. If a few Xojo users can easily make a feedback case rise to the top 20 in a matter of hours, I would think participation there must be very low. Same goes for the forum, even Xojo say only a fraction of their users participate in the forum.
I would think most people using Xojo very lightly (like myself) are mostly happy with it. But that doesn’t mean what they deliver is right. Customers pay for a service, and the sevice they provide is getting worse every time, to some extent (concerning the increaseing number of bugs, some of which affect many people like the problems with the IDE).
Finally, the sentence below doesn’t make much sense, you are full of the anger you are talking about… which again doesn’t help your case here.
