King of Xojo customers…

This was a question no one gave a satisfactory answer.

Yesterday, a strange idea comes to my mind:

What is the target customer is a Xojo new comer (not necessary a newbie, just a new comer).

What is the feeling of a new comer ? After some minutes, this person is happy. This state continues until we get a fan boy (or a fan girl).
What do a fan boy/girl ? Evangelise around is what is done by a fan boy/girl !!!

You see what I mean ? Sales…

And after sometimes, that (these) person reach the Xojo edges, ask for features, bug removals, etc.

At last, this person is no more a Xojo target customer (no more a fan boy, but an angry person).
“I wasted my time and money here”

What is your feeling on this analyze ?


Xojo promotes itself as a Cross-Platform Development tool. Working with cross-platform tools often involves making compromises, and I believe everyone who uses such tools, whether a beginner or a pro, is aware of this. As a result, users are generally willing to accept some workarounds.

For years, this approach has worked reasonably well. Although not perfect, Xojo had valid explanations for its limitations, and it’s worth noting that the company often faced challenges from operating system manufacturers. Ultimately, users were content with the way Xojo adapted to new developments.

As long as Xojo (or Realbasic) focused on desktop applications, the limitations were well-known and transparent. Internet integration was a secondary concern, and users knew what they were getting into.

However, in my opinion, things have changed dramatically since the rebranding to Xojo. More and more promises were made (including some that were unsustainable), marketing efforts increased, and simultaneously, the number of bugs grew. Instead of stabilizing the product, unnecessary priorities were set, in my view. This has led to increased dissatisfaction among customers, as they now have to face reality checks more quickly and are reaching their limits.

A few still stick to Xojo with gritted teeth because they don’t want to learn an alternative or don’t have the time. Although you are actually making life more difficult for yourself in 2023. But everyone has to decide that for themselves.

The idea behind RB/Xojo is still good. But for a handful of developers, the scope is just too big. One could argue that even big companies like MS can’t pull this off, and Xojo does an excellent job. That is certainly correct in part. What such a small team can do is impressive. The only problem I have is that it is not recognized that we have 2023 and that “a good enough from 2008” is no longer sufficient today.

In addition, the world has not remained stagnant. We now have numerous open-source IDEs, many more free programming languages, and a variety of tools that more or less effectively tackle cross-platform development.

Thus, the question arises: under these circumstances, who would want to become a new customer, or who would actively seek out Xojo at all?

In any case, someone who has experienced the benefits of Git and understands the value of IDEs that truly assist, for example, by displaying help in pop-ups and offering autocomplete and refactoring features, will likely be disappointed. IDEs that start quickly and can integrate with any database on the planet make Xojo appear outdated. Xojo seems to have recognized this, indicating that more experienced users are no longer the primary focus.


Which is exactly what I have warning them about, I don’t believe that this is a long term sustainable business model.

It doesn’t encourage growth or improve positive awareness over the long run.


You can warn as often as you want to. it will not change anything in their mind. The Point is: the target is not the Pro. Exactly that they have to say nobody would be or become angry. But then: who wants to buy a tool not good for professional use? Nobody. True. So this is named unbreakable circuit.


anything, when you can get better solutions for free? :slight_smile: - well, I was one of them. But that only makes sense with an olympic spirit of supporting a “start up”, etc. - Vintage car owners can’t expect to collect a lot of money via crowd-funding.

and we see a trend to free Xojo plugins. I wonder when will the first commercial plugin vendor throw in the towel.

Outside of the TextInputCanvas (Which Xojo Inc originally released as open source but did not support) and the big number stuff which has been around forever) what other plugins (not Xojo/RB source code) have become available in the last few years?


For “citizen developers”, particularly those that need Xplatform desktop and to get things done quickly, there simply is not the time to learn not only a new language but it’s ecosystem…

For myself I am close to the end of my career… I will be likely be retired any time between now and 3 years from now… and my job has changed (in a manner I don’t like BTW) such that there will be very few (if any) opportunities to code anything for work. So if something does comes up, the only thing that make sense for me is Xojo API 1.


This post should have been titled “the evolution of a Xojo customer”

  1. new & infatuated with how great everything is
  2. experienced and maybe can answer questions on the forums
  3. finder of bugs and dutifully submits them to get fixed “real soon”
  4. power user that resorts to plugins to get features that are missing and maybe work around the bugs they continue to find
  5. starting to get upset since the bugs they reported that they hoped would get fixed real soon haven’t been touched
  6. upset their bugs haven’t been touched at all
  7. no longer a member of the target audience and dismissed or ignored by Xojo as a whiner

Mine for instance :slight_smile: Opensource Xojo Web 2 plugins

But they are dated (from 2021), not sure if they will still work with the current version. I got some 40 EURs from very nice people who supported the idea (not sure though if they even used them). When I still ran a Xojo Web2 dummy site to show what is possible I tracked the downloads. First year was roughly 30 downloads, so literally nothing.

At least they can give someone the idea how to write web2 plugins. The TypeScript inside is most likely ridiculously wrong. That was my first learning of TS and when I had learned it, I left the green software and never looked back.

4b) Power users who are learning that they have to get upvoting people, before their bug will get analysed.

6b) Phone call with the genius boss, that 4b never happened and learning that YOU are the challenge but NOT the tool.

7b) back to school and learning a new language.

  1. finished steps 1 thru 7b, selected a new developement tool, and moved on
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Garry’s plugin for example. Was intended to be a commercial plugin but the small Xojo developer market said no. Garry kindly released it as open source.


Xojo decided to really focus on new users years ago

And that focus meant things that full time professional developers needed/wanted/hoped that Xojo would focus on never happened

And, they got what they decided to pursue
Lots of new users with now experience and the people who could have or would have helped those new people out have left BECAUSE they saw, very clearly, the they were not Xojo’s focus

Web 2 was a good example
If you had a sizeable Web1 app that you had created & had lots fusers Web 2 was literally “Yeah thats once now rewrite EVERYTHING”
No migration strategy or tool or assistance to make that move
If you were new to Xojo it seemed like a lot of whining from people about not being able to move their projects because they’d just start a new one in Web 2 and go

API 2 just added to that as it was in flux - but still released - and things like autocomplete for existing projects were just turned off so it made working on and old project to move it to newer IDE’s unnecessarily difficult
Again if you were new to Xojo it seemed like a lot of whining from people about not being able to move their projects because they’d just start a new one and go and just start with API 2

Anyone that had existing projects was punished(?) for having been a long term customer

Which is about the time INN got started because all the complaints from long term users were in threads being locked, closed, those users suspended or banned.
And when INN got started


Devil’s advocate: en résumé it can safely be stated that the true king among Xojo customers is the former Xojo customer. :imp:


Dismissed and considered a troll… By xojo and those in steps 2-5 :upside_down_face:

Everybody ranting about bugs and policY is a troll for them

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Somewhere there needs to be a step where you make friends with one or more of the Xojo developers to sneak a bug fix in that’s critical to what you’re working on. :wink:

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Naw I cant imagine ANYONE ever did that :stuck_out_tongue:

Here’s another one who dropped Xojo and open-sourced their Xojo-based product: