Alternatives to Xojo?

[npalardy]

As an aside Prograph survives to this day (more or less)
http://www.andescotia.com/products/marten/
Not sure it has kept up with the times though

[DrScott]

Marten is not being maintained (except as needed by its author for his own professional projects). It had just been given the ability to compile for Cocoa instead of Carbon, then development slowed. If you look up the documentation on that site, you’ll see a link to download my book for free.

[ivan]

@SteveW

I don’t think it’s right to suggest such things are “just a toy intended for children”. I don’t imagine many children have an interest in DeFi or DApps.

They already have the textual coding part, if they are ading a graphical counterpart, maybe is to cover the users described by @Rick.A

[thorstenstueker]

But they are not even a bit an alternative to Xojo.

[SteveW]

@Rick.A

It’s for 3 kinds of people: Children learning, Teens learning, and Adults that have problems to organize their ideas as code in their heads.

What if I’m more interested in creating an app rather than learning to program? If I didn’t know programming already but I could achieve everything I wanted by dragging and dropping blocks like building with Lego what would be my incentive to do anything else? Isn’t that a 4th kind of person?

Are people who drag and drop loops into a sequencer really song writers?

Do you care if an app was created visually if it does the job?
Do you care if a song was created from loops if it sounds good?

I don’t see App Inventor as a toy, I see it as a tool.

[thorstenstueker]

I can’t regret to see it as a tool. That was never the question. The question was if it can replace Xojo. If somebody does not want to learn programming it is more a solution than Java. If somebody needs it for professional programming with all flexibility there is the direct need of a programming language. Therefore Java for example could replace Xojo. But not that tool you showed.

Tools like this where becoming interesting and modern at the end of the 90th. It is long time ago. And there is not that much happened that I can say it replaces the programming language and the control you have from it.

[Karen]

@DrScott

I should also add that I also used LabVIEW, another visual language,

I once needed to modify a LabView app that controlled a custom instrument about 12ish years ago… hated having to deal with string handling in it!

-Karen

[npalardy]

@SteveW

I don’t see App Inventor as a toy, I see it as a tool.

These kinds of tools have a place
I dont think any one would say labview is a toy
And it has a graphical view o f processes it controls (Anyone know if it has other views of things as well ? I havent looked at it in 20 years or more)

@thorstenstueker

Tools like this where becoming interesting and modern at the end of the 90th.

They are again as tools for domain experts or low/no code use
MS PowerApps and several other low and no code tools for instance
OutSystems and others use graphical representations - but they are more “processes” than “line by line code” from what I can see
Like these

Are they a direct replacement for Xojo ? On a line of code for line of code basis no
But could you use these to do some/all of what Xojo does ? It looks like there are possibilities
Can you use one of these do create desktop, server web ios and android apps ? No
But then you use multiple tools with a single language to do that

Alternatives exist in many forms depending on how you used xojo and what you need to do with it

[bkeeney]

@DrScott

I should also add that I also used LabVIEW, another visual language, for building a large system for presenting visual stimuli and collecting physiological and psychophysical responses.

Labview is still used in FIRST robotics along with Java, C, and Python. I think it really matters on what the mentors are familiar with and willing to teach these high school kids. LabView is pretty common in engineering jobs but Java and C are more commonly used. I’ve personally heard of more teams struggling with LabView than Java and C.

I don’t know what the breakdown of teams (several thousand worldwide) but I’d have to guess that Labview is less than 25% of all team.

[supcumps]

Yes,
But if you look at tge site, they have code that enables you to develop an app to play SPACE INVADERS!!!

[Rick.A]

@Rick.A

It’s for 3 kinds of people: Children learning, Teens learning, and Adults that have problems to organize their ideas as code in their heads.

@SteveW

If I didn’t know programming already but I could achieve everything I wanted by dragging and dropping blocks like building with Lego what would be my incentive to do anything else? Isn’t that a 4th kind of person?

I don’t think so, I think that your example fits on the 3rd kind.

[npalardy]

This looks like an interesting set of projects
https://docs.beeware.org/en/latest/index.html#

[eugenedakin]

Beeware looks VERY encouraging. Has anyone created binaries or executables that pass the requirements to be placed in the Microsoft Store or Apple Store?

Just asking.

[npalardy]

Just tinkering with it at present and getting feet wet with the tool set

[Emile]

They have this kind of documentation:

Obtaining a Code Signing identity

[Joseph]

@npalardy

tinkering with it at present

Awesome! Give us the rundown when you get comfortable with it.

[bkeeney]

That’s well done documentation!

[Joseph]

@bkeeney

That’s well done documentation!

It’s like an online recipe sans the 9 paragraph intro that talks about how their meemaw passed it down to them.

[ivan]

Some interesting options for WebApps

I built 10 web apps... with 10 different languages

[Bad_Wolf]

In my opinion the best alternative to Xojo is Python. It is free, the most popular language, multi-platform and you can also create runtimes.

It is also easy to learn. What do you want more?