That is a prettier urn than Xojo deserves
My view on this:
Xojo Inc (i.e. Geoff) doesn’t believe (or understand) that it’s more important to keep your current customers happy than trying to get new ones. Using a programming system is a long-time investment for many small businesses that I’ve encountered using Xojo. As long as their business runs with the devevelopment system (i.e. Xojo), they’ll keep paying for it, even if it’s getting more expensive over time, because they can do the math and understand that it’s still worth the money - provided they can keep relying on it.
But Xojo keeps disgruntling these customers, e.g. by changing behaviors or even APIs and then telling them that it’s in their best interest (without even asking them first). That breaks the customers’ trust in Xojo and they’ll naturally look for an exit strategy.
Yes, there’s also the customers that don’t become long-term ones, e.g. as students. But those won’t pay the high “pro” prices, usually. Xojo’s (mislead) strategy is to keep pretending to offer new features (Android, iOS, Web), all with large flaws, as we’ve all learned in the past, all the while they disgruntle their long-term customers, which are the base to keep the company alive.
The problem is not even a missing product lead / manager. It’s the ignorance of the leadership towards their long-term customers and the repeated attempts at making false promises in hopes of winning the lottery with one of them. Which is a very short-sighted strategy.
I believe that if the leadership would be transferred to someone who is more trusted by the customer base, then it could still all be saved. But Geoff had made it clear many times that it’s less important to him to offer a good sustainable product but rather to keep his ego as a second Steve Jobs alive. He’s simply delusional and there’s no hope unless someone kicks him out and robs him of his Precious.
I disagree, they could opensource the compiler and maybe some cli workers to create executables but continue to sell the IDE and of course their hosted webspaces and support.
Every Pro or every Company once decided to build its tools on any technology will buy regular updates and support too.
In this case I would like to say: I doubt it. While I know that there are anyhow not so many customers anymore I guess: there is no chance to get enough sales. Open Sourcing the technology would provide that also for others. And the IDE is not a so had animal to rewrite when you have a compiler. I would make a bet: it would come another, an alternative IDE for the language. And then? What will be the future of the company?
You’ve made a good point Thomas, to transfer the leadership to someone else.
But who? A bought CEO with 2-year contract? Somebody only looking for fast money and profit? The Xojo Project is already down, this would give it the rest. And could ever a CEO resists to Geoff Perlman in the background as shareholder, still trying to manage “his baby”? Sounds quite unrealistic to me.
Opensource the project, give the community the control over the language. This would be the best option. If not, I see a long decline to meaninglessness.
Took me a long while hoping, wishing, thinking of ways to cope but eventually reality set in. Xojo’s a dead product in my opinion. It’s good for some like those that only use Desktop. For Web, iOS, and Android it’s dead end…
Moving on is the only choice. 
Application Systems Heidelberg was still interesting in taking over only a few years ago, for instance. They have a long history of publishing, sponsering and supporting development systems, since the late 80s. And I’d be willing to put in my efforts, too. I had worked briefly, around 2008, on the IDE and framework source. I have quite some deep insight of how it should work. If I’d take over development, I’d focus on making the product stable at first, and for Desktop primarily, while keeping the other platforms in a maintenance mode. Android and iOS I’d probably drop entirely (i.e. in its current state), unless we’d find dedicated developers who know their stuff.
There’s still the question of keeping it profitable. Hence, the first step after (or even before) taking over would be to send out an honest poll to the registered users, explaining the possible paths, and letting them give input on what their needs and commitments are. Based on that a realistic plan can be made, and if the customers can be convinced to put their trust into the new team, this can work out. Or not, if the current customer base is already too small to keep it going at all.
But even with that - unless Geoff gives Xojo away voluntarily, with the goal of letting someone else make it profitable again, and only then paying out dividents to him and his partner(s), this won’t work. Thus, only if Geoff really sees that his current path is hopeless and still wants the product to recover, this has any chance of success.
You said: “If I’d take over development, I’d focus on making the product stable at first, and for Desktop primarily, while keeping the other platforms in a maintenance mode. Android and iOS I’d probably drop entirely (i.e. in its current state), unless we’d find dedicated developers who know their stuff.”
there comes the first question I would have: when making it stable like you said it would have to be financed to make it stable. And exactly that is the problem while for that you need man power and especially technical specialists Xojo does not have at the moment. It Is not only a question of taking care it is also a question of the structure your dev department has. They still have no compiler guy and that would not change immediately. BTW it is so that even Desktop only has also not a big market chance. One of the nice parts leading people to buy Xojo is exactly that X Platform stuff. And Desktop only: that ou can have with other systems in the same quality. But without new users you may have problems to get them and the old ones which want and need that X Platform stuff will not pay Updates for Desktop which they possibly do not really need or not as main target need. Web and IOS are now Platforms which are anyhow not that much in use, you are right but do you really think that Xojo could compete with for example Java or C# with Desktop only for the prices you have to pay for it at the moment?
and your argument that Mr. Perlman would never give it ut of his hands: I also doubt that he would ever allow that. He thinks and believes that he makes everything totally right and correct and that he is the best one for that Job. And he is the owner, let’s say the master of the vessel. So he will not. Of coarse not.
In my eyes that train left the station before four or five years. Decisions made for the future were destroying the chance to build it up newly. Even if the users would carry it. There is not enough user activity like you can see. It polarizes like it is at the moment. But alone Desktop will have around 1000 Bugs. And this amount of Bugs to fix will cost much money and much effort.’
So I can’t see any chance for recusing Xojo in a real view. Exactly that’s the sad point. There is no way out even if you would be the chief from tomorrow morning on. There is no I would do. While there is no you could do.
They had a great DTP program called Signum! for Atari ST.
I bet they had something to do with Modula-2 for the Atari St as well! 
-Karen (Way back when I had Modual-2 for the ST, but I suspect it was not that specific product as the docs were in English)
Would you please edit your post so that it’s clear what you wrote vs. what you quoted from me? It’s difficult to read at the moment
Right, “our” Modula-2 (published by ASH) was called Megamax Modula-2 and all docs were in German only. The sources are still available somewhere deep within my website.
I suggest to encapsulate the if-statement in the above line of code into a try/catch, otherwise a kernel panic is in the air .
In the last consequences you are right. No question. And that is also not a bad Idea. It would lead into an automatically secure situation for the users but not the company. While that is the problem they will not do it from the first line.
The next point is: th history teacher me that it is not the most simple thing to take care of a Language and a compiler with a community. There is a big bunch of problems where solutions need to be builded up and that still needs tons of assistance and money. Money which is still now not available.
I would see it if there was more than the small niche Xojo is filling now but I don’t see it on a big market for a big audience. This times are gone, thy passed by.We are speaking about an old language and an old concept. Still brilliant, no question, still shiny. But not working on so many places.
Compare it with other open Source projects like CodenameOne. You can see they’re how. it is to build up a monster framework and hold it on it’s market and it’s market position. Or JavaFX. You need thousands of hours for Bug fixing and maintaining while every day something important changes and has to be fixed.
Xojo Inc (i.e. Geoff) doesn’t believe (or understand) that it’s more important to keep your current customers happy than trying to get new ones.
100% but while existing userbase drops during time its important to maintain a steady flow of new customers jumping onto the train.
As long as their business runs with the devevelopment system (i.e. Xojo), they’ll keep paying for it, even if it’s getting more expensive over time
This was exactly what I’ve done for over a decade. it was my main tool for RAD, i used my rocksolid objects and tollchains and it was simply irrelevant if the annual fee was tagged with 500 or 600 bucks. Heck I’ve even accepted that there is no native xplatform datepicker in Xojo and relied on Einhugurs’ controls.
Yes, there’s also the customers that don’t become long-term ones, e.g. as students. But those won’t pay the high “pro” prices,
Therefore an GPL’ed xojo would not harm that much and gain more visibility and a fellow community with new ideas, inspiration and mostly a healthy ecosystem in 10 years.
a second Steve Jobs
Even Steve Jobs understood, when to step aside and let others manage things. If you look behind the halo you see many developments and products, where steve jobs failed and others helped to recreate them.
He’s simply delusional and there’s no hope unless someone kicks him out and robs him of his Precious.
Some people tend to tear down what they have had build up. They’re loosing track, are fixated on short-time results and financial needs and do not oversee long-time effects. They simply do not follow a vision anymore. And here we have the difference between Geoff Perlman and Steve Jobs.
Having said that: XPlatform- and RAD is a vision XOJO has lost. Hell, yes drop iOS and Android, fix Desktop (mainly Linux and Windows) and rebuild Web! And GPL the f***ing compiling toolchain.
And again, that would not help. While the Xojo System needs to exist. Nobody possibly would buy an IDE and what if an alternative IDE would be builded. with a GPL compiler it would not be a problem to implement the Language for example within an IntelliJIdea Project and then…the Xojo IDE is worthless as is. That would result in a dead project. And that for sure they know. While there is no big user base which can carry a big open Source project like that and maintain it. And the company would not be able to also while no incomes.
The only chance for Xojo to get to the right direction is: fixing the Bugs and fixing the X-Platform stuffs and go in front. With Web 2.0 they have done a good Idea but a bad Job while cutting all Web 1.0 Customers from their projects. Now, in this situation: that is anyhow a dead end. There is no need to rebuild but to fix and enhance the existing Web 2.0 framework to make it harder for future needs.
What we have here now is a system which has a future. If it will have a future of a bug fixing and taking care culture inside the company and another release cycle which makes it possible to rely on it with the development.
One of the most problematical facts is the missing release system which makes it impossible to rely: nobody knows when what why how will be deprecated not working renamed or something. Like in Web and Desktop…msgbox and message box…same thing two commands…that is the result of the mess they made and they had not to make it like this.
This shows how they try to act. Unorganized and not in a float and planning. Exactly that is needed. Ability of planning not only for the Xojo staffs but also for the customers and users.
Nobody possibly would buy an IDE and what if an alternative IDE would be builded.
The Xojo IDE is not just defined by an Editor and some Intellisense-like gadgets around it. It consist mainly of the project tree and graphical enviroment to create forms. I’ve never used the reporting and database parts of it (in my understanding they are more or less abandoned and left behind) but for new users they might be helpful. You won’t get this additional, straightforward value with notepad++ or Codium quickly.
That would result in a dead project.
What Xojo basically is, at least for many of us here. Like in the movie 6th sense: I see dead people, they do not know they are dead. And this is sad, because I really loved it, still love the basic language.
What we have here now is a system which has a future
Nope, the future is opensource, even Microsoft discovered this. My customers and I for myself never ever invest in something proprietary, depending only on a single company (or in Xojos’ case a single person).
Unorganized and not in a float and planning.
Even with a certain degree of planning, they do not have the ressources to maintain such a huge project.
We do not have to discuss that open source is the best. I am using java. Fully open Source. CodenameOne for Mobile: open Source. Vaadin for WebApps. Open Source. Swing for Desktop…anyhow also open Source. For me there is no other way. But what I can’t see is the way Xojo could go open Source. And by the way I don’t get why this graphical project tree is so important but maybe that while I am used to Java, C++ and so on. That may derive for Xojo users. For me sometimes for example the behavior with variables and this graphical stuffs is sometimes more annoying but helping. But like I said: maybe others having other Ideas about and other uses.