Xojo Can't Compare

I’m starting a campaign to put pressure on Xojo to fix their comparison bug and I’d appreciate the help spreading the word. https://thezaz.com/blog/xojo_cant_compare

I think even if their forum post wasn’t closed, I wouldn’t have posted this there as it could be considered rule breaking. I was originally going to wait until Monday to publish this so I could see how the conversation evolved over the weekend. Hell, my desire was not to post it at all and to convince them directly. But considering they’re no longer willing to discuss it, it leaves me with little choice if I want to see Xojo improved.

Sidenote: this kind of stuff is why my work is never featured on any Xojo resource, despite being an ex-employee and maintaining the #3 Xojo project on GitHub. Used to be #2 though.


Ready for a 1000 year ban from the Xojo forum? :wink:

If they are not going to fix it they should AT LEAST make it a compilation error . A warning is just not enough.

Yes that would mean having to use CType, and yes it would break old code even if the specific use would not cause an error…

But IMO if they are not going to fix it (which would have no negative effects on existing code that I can see), it is a serious enough of an issue to warrant it.


I’ve tweeted about your post @thommcgrath. Geoff’s response is disgraceful. I honestly think he doesn’t understand the problem. I’m particularly pissed as I think my physics engine (currently thousands of lines of code) is almost certainly being bitten by this.

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Perhaps @bkeeney will post about it too as he has a strong readership.
I like the #XojoCantMath hashtag btw.


I like the hashtag too, but I think it’s wrong. XojoCantCompare I think fits better. First, math isn’t a verb. Second, compare also makes it sound like Xojo can’t compare to the competition. From a marketing standpoint, which is basically what this has become, it makes more sense.


I wonder if this is one of those differences between British English and American ?

I often hear people talking about taking courses in “Maths” or studying “Maths” from the UK
I dont usually question it but its not something you hear in North America often - if ever

Honestly, I have no idea. I never thought about it.

They’re just hashtags
Cant you use both ?

I mean… yes. But that feels clumsy.

IMO its great what it is, it caught my eye immediately, anybody who actually reads the full text will understand.

“Xojo Can’t Compare” is both intriguing and critical, also it is correct no matter what English dialect you use.

There you go https://www.bkeeneybriefs.com/2020/10/xojo-cant-math/


I disagree that MATH is a verb (regardless of what those websites say). MATH is short for MATHEMATICS with is at best an Adjective as it describes a subject matter… but it is NOT an action… (again regardless of those web sites)…

“She was mathing on the blackboard” is a non-senscial sentence
“Shw was doing math on the blackboard” is correct

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I think stick with “Xojo Can’t Compare” for actual hashtags. Article titles can be anything related.

  1. It’s catchy
  2. It’s proper in all dialects
  3. It has multiple connotations, all of them intriguing.
  4. Useful and generic enough to link to other campaigns as they arise. (wide impact surface)

What do you think Geoff?


Sounds like an open invitation :grinning:

As long as they are not bad experiences, contain critical statements, express honest concerns or expose bugs, I think you’re good…


I’m not going to cause trouble on social media yet. I’m nothing if not fair. Let’s see what kind of response the blog posts get after a few days, even though I’m not expecting anything. Like I said in my opening comment, my goal was not to make a blog post at all. I don’t want to put the effort into creating noise and bad press. I want Xojo to do well. That’s why I put so much effort into the forum thread. If helping them get this resolved means being obnoxious, so be it. How obnoxious is basically a function of how long it takes for them to agree to do something about it.


If it may be of some help, here you can find the RB/Xojo source code of such an engine I did a couple of years ago: https://alwaysbusycorner.com/2014/03/06/xojorealbasic-abpe-the-physics-engine/

I did indeed - ABPE I believe it was. Very cool. I wanted something that supported joints. I wrote my own simple one in Xojo (ImpulseEngine) but for my second iteration I’m porting a Java library called dyn4j.

I think I recall looking into that one too!

We know the goal is not to cause any trouble, the goal is to hold Xojo Inc. accountable to it’s customers and fix the product and it’s chronic and systemic deficiencies.

If Geoff committed to (and delivered) a few Bug only releases and overhauled the system so that it did not continue to decay, I would not only take a Pro Plus license right away, but I would also tell everybody who would listen that they made good.

There have been many examples of companies producing shit tier products being called out, listening to their customers, fixing long standing deficiencies and regaining, and sometimes exceeding their wildest expectations.

Apple Computer Inc. 90 Days from bankruptcy, fragmented and nonsensical product lines, outrageous prices plummeting customer sentiment, gigantic competitors, blunder after blunder while abandoning what made them great. Turned around, now household name, 12 largest worldwide by revenue. One man doing what was needed and right.

Jack In The Box Inc. In the 1980s-90s (jack was the meal of last resort) Declining sales, near insolvency due to stagnating menu offerings, horse-meat and e-coli drove the company to the bottom of the food chain. They opened a test kitchen, hired some better experts, revamped all the menu with high quality items, better portions and revamped all locations to represent the major overhaul. Jack in the box recovered and is thriving by focusing on delivering a better product rather then being among the lowest common denominator. 2.25 Billion in revenue, and tasty food I might add.


Point being, it is possible to pull this out of the fire, the effort and customer pressure must be targeted in that direction and in support of that objective. We all want Xojo to thrive. With enough of the right pressure, the wall will eventually crack and some healthy changes can take place. Right now, there is no incentive for leadership to consider it, no consequences for their behavior and the status quo has always been available once the mob goes back to sleep. (This is what is happening right now, in a few weeks this will blow over and they can go right back to ripping people off)

Action must be precisely targeted at an exact outcome, it must not be out of the correct bounds of intensity (weak or strong) to miss the mark on getting change to occur. It must be constant, responsive, gradual and escalating as needed based upon reaction. It will eventually work, if done correctly.