Its expected they will get there
We’ll see how it pans out
Are they using native controls on the desktop ?
Some people care about that stuff.
It remains to be seen
But there ARE several efforts from several vendors that certainly could sideswipe Xojo
Nope. To be true what they did is better, they have full control of everything to a bit in the screen, and mimic anything you want. The “native like” control set for iOS is called “cupertino”, for example. No one should notice that it is not native, this way they even can fix native control sets less capable behaviors. The “flickering” thing in Windows will be non-existent too.
Which also means that they’ll stand out like a sore thumb when / if Apple / MS make fixes to their native controls
They wont necessarily automatically adapt to OS changes
Thats is the attraction for native controls (at least on macOS)
Never mind being able to manipulate them using system API’s
Again - until it ships we really cant know better / worse or what
Some apps using it are already in the market and no one noticed about UI or cared about the UX, to be true, the opposed, liked the UX. The UX can be what the designer wants. If you are not a good designer, the trivial themed pack serves you. Same will occur with desktop.
Compiled for Android:
Its not ready to cover the same set of targets that Xojo is
We’ll talk again when it is
OK ?
Until then its NOT a contender to replace Xojo
(And no like others I’m not prepared to write 3 different apps just to cover macOS windows and linux - never mind iOS android & web)
Yeah, we’ve had this conversion in here recently and whilst I do like Flutter and Dart and agree that it’s going to gain a lot of traction it’s not aimed at the same market as Xojo developers.
Writing your UI in code is a ball ache and this is the biggest win for Xojo for me. I wrote a simple iOS app in Flutter last week and it took FORVER and tons of code just to get a basic interface up.
As I’ve said before, if Google ever make it like Xojo with a drag and drop IDE then it will be a game changer, until then it just joins a very crowded market of similar tools.
“Citizen devs” ? You are correct.
Because you are using the 2019 tooling. But even right now, have you tried Supernova? https://supernova.io/features/flutter
Is supernova an official part of googles toolchain ?
we keep getting dragged into the “yeah but you can add X, Y and X and no its not part of the official release but …”
I dont use linux for EXACTLY this reason
I dont want to be a sys admin
I dont want to make my dev environment from 10 different tool chains
Esp since so many times you follow directions and then it doesnt work and the replies you get are “hey well it works for me tough luck for you”
Anyone who knows that writing code to build a UI is a 1980’s paradigm
Not all Xojo customers are “Citizen Devs”
I don’t want to have to buy 3 different products (which may or may not stick around / interact), even then it’s not the same drag and drop paradigm as Xojo. Not even close.
Well, let’s talk again about it in 2022, too soon for a proper conversation about the final toolset, when ready, and integrated into the Studio.
Works for me
All the tooling is free. Even many layout designers that are working right now, as Supernova, are free (for Flutter). A basic website for fast prototyping / designing your interfaces already exists (
https://flutterstudio.app/ ). All free. One thing you won’t need for “basic features” is wasting money.
You completely missing the point
NONE OF US CARES IF ITS FREE
Having to grab and configure multiple tools and products isnt what I’m interested in
I’ll use Xcode … why ?
Download once and go - no other tools to configure etc just download & go
VS - same thing
And if that means I have to pay someone to produce a single tool that I can download, pay for a license, and just use I’m happy
I dont want to administer systems or configure tools chains
People do that now because … THEY HAVE NO CHOICE
This IS how you work because none of the “tool providers” has the foresight to make something that has all this crap wrapped into a single distributable package a person can just download and use
So people do what they need to do to work in whatever tool set they are working in
As do I
It’s not free. Adobe XD is £10 a month in the UK (the free plan is so hamstrung as to be next to useless). The SuperNova you linked to is $25 a month. etc etc.
Supernova has an agreement with Google. Is free for Flutter. Using Sketch or Adobe XD is great but optional. You can drag and drop components from the library without them.
Believe just ONE thing I say, this tooling will only go forward, and will dominate the market because it is just unique and complete. There are more public code in dart in just few years than what was put in github in the entire history of Xojo. Will it be a “citizen dev” preference? I guess no. The Xojo Lego way of programming is easier but limiting too. Too much power that that tool will offer will add a bit o complexity the old pals won’t handle, and that’s the market Geoff wants to explore, since always.
126 Xojo repos
75k Dart repos