Suggestions for a Xojo replacement to create cloud web apps

G = Greatest
O = of
A = All
T = Time

  • Karen

Hahaha Karen, thanks to try to give me a nice description but my language barrier is smaller than you may think. By the way I am not even close to be that. It is not a bit so. I am programmer and I have every day to do with the stuffs my Customers trying to do, spending tons of money in projects and at the end they have to realize that it is not working like they thought it will. Sometimes in the long run while tools becoming deprecated and sometimes in the short run while reaching borders, often also cause of needed but impossible workarounds, needed ecosystem around and so on. And yes, I am becoming more and more stiff cause I lost the power to discuss every point of stuffs like that. I have my Team of programmers which I have to lead to the best possible solution for every project. After 3 years of Stueker Software I can say: I saw many coming and more going. I saw bright shining tools which where the state of the art and passed by after a few years. I saw language changes which destroyed the work of years within seconds.

And yes, I love pro languages while I definitely know: this sourcecode you can use now for long time. Look on it so: write a program in Flutter for Desktop with Dart as programming language. Can you now tell me if this is supported in 2030? Is not it is not worth of thinking about. Why? While seven years are really short and it would be nice that you can use all the stuffs at least for this time.

But even with C++ and QT I don’t have this, I can grant there that I have supported ecosystem until 2028. No problem when you anyhow have to maintain the project and build every year a new version of it. But I don’t like bone breakers in the middle like served by Xojo when switched to API 2. And this kind of API changes you will have with projects like GO definitely.

The next question is the ecosystem around. I can understand people using for example C# Dotnet technology. Super IDea. Microsoft has a brilliant system for their Third Party vendors of libs. Again a System where you have to pay for every byte of the ecosystem. Not that nice in my eyes. And even there is the API granted for: 2 years max. Maybe you can run older Apps. But who knows if that is also with the next versions of Windows? And how will it be when Windows needs two builds: X86/64 and ARM/64? Will everything run? No. it will not. Short answer.

And exactly from that point of view I can see here programmers with small budgets working on projects and are in the need to provide updates for the next years or the project is dead.

What do I use and why? Simple answer: if one platform only I use the platform native. Like Xcode/Swift/SwiftUI for IOS and like Kotlin for Android. Exactly while it is always the best Solution. No Flutter and no Dart can handle that kind of projects like this.

When it shall be for both mobile platforms: depends. Shall it be with native UI in both projects? Okay, Kotlin Multiplatform Mobile with Swift UI for IOS and Android UI for Android. Super. If it also has to run on Desktop and the customer needs to work on it for both platforms? CodenameOne, pure Java, Build Servers, no terror of toolchains and simple made. Granted running until: at least 2030 from now on. Foreseeable until 2040.

This examples are showing a simple thing: if you want and need to maintain the application you have no chance than building exactly so that you will be able to maintain for years. And not for weeks. When I am complaining about solutions mostly while I don’t like to look with wide opened eyes to an accident which I could prevent. I’ll stop with this while I had to learn: not interesting for users. That’s okay, also I have to learn stuffs like this. I am only a scientist which wants people not to run into situations like this. Nothing else. But if they don’t want, I don’t care. Also simple.

And there was me thinking it means “Goes Over Any type of Terrain”… Which would explain why when I see GOAT being used on social media it doesn’t make any sense!


Yet both the companies and their products have been in existence for 1 and a half decades or more.

Just seems odd that one is completely unreachable
And one has broken portions of their web site

For me, living in the Boston area for many years, coming across the term GOAT a lot was unavoidable because of Tom Brady!


The guy might be an ass in many ways but he was a great quarterback
The Pats would never have been the team they were without him

Here at my side both are reachable!

A month later and their examples are still not working :man_facepalming:t2:

Sure, main page is there… also the store. But the examples are dead so, Not very reliable

It is what it is: not an alternative. Even if Yogi wants it to be Ivan.

@thorstenstueker sorry for my question, I have used (little) java in the past and I don’t know anything about vaadin.
is the Core version of vaadin enough for development and deployment?
I see there is a visual designer in the Pro version, but the cost is unaffordable for me ($139/mo/seat).
thank you

It is enough.

1 Like

Like what we thought we though Xojo was supposed to be:
Goes (works) On Any Terrain (platform)

I used to love the old web engine, drag and drop colours on a webpage, now it’s time consuming and awkward. Gave up on Web 2.0 things just take more time and not obvious