# Moving away from Xojo **URL:** \ **Category:** Xojo\ **Created:** [5 April 2022 18:54 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416 "2022-04-05T18:54:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![MGD](https://ifnotnil.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/m/e47774/32.png) [@MGD](https://ifnotnil.com/u/MGD)\ **Post date:** [30 October 2022 15:55 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/122 "2022-10-30T15:55:31Z")
Thanks; appreciate the suggestions. I have thoroughly examined these options, and at least in my case, a Java-based solution is not possible. While I haven’t committed to Vala as my way forward (I’m still exploring it), it is the frontrunner. As I mentioned, I hope to be able to share some of the research and resources I’ve used during the last several years in planning my exit from Xojo for others to examine for their particular cases. > I guess that would be less complex and not that crime you do with the GTK Components to the users eye’s Cross-platform look-and-feel, the native-vs-rendered argument, ever-changing style trends, and overall ecosystem stability were things I’ve considered > I can not see any good in Vala Then you’ll likely be surprised with what I’m doing 😉 > [@thorstenstueker](#): > > Since it is builded for what it is: a Gnome GTK Builder and it is enhanced Swith a few Libs for other OSS’es it is still not really made for cross platform. And it is Definitely a long term tool while the Desktop Development of the Vala community is always for Gnome technologies first. This does remain a concern, for sure, and the source of my question to this community about experiences on Mac and Windows. ---
**Author:** ![thorstenstueker](https://ifnotnil.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/t/aca169/32.png) [@thorstenstueker](https://ifnotnil.com/u/thorstenstueker)\ **Post date:** [30 October 2022 15:58 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/123 "2022-10-30T15:58:46Z")
> [@MGD](#): > > This does remain a concern, for sure, and the source of my question to this community about experiences on Mac and Windows. beside the question I have about the non possible Java Application…I did not speak about native GUI. By the way Have fun with Vala. I only wanted to let you know what I would not do. If not Java while not compiled: use GraalVM native Image for compilation instead. It is then without a JVM. ---
**Author:** ![YogiYang](https://ifnotnil.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@YogiYang](https://ifnotnil.com/u/YogiYang)\ **Post date:** [1 November 2022 07:25 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/124 "2022-11-01T07:25:18Z")
Hello, Why Vala at all?!?! Why not try out Free Pascal using Pilot Logic’s CodeTyphon Studio? > **[CodeTyphon About](https://www.pilotlogic.com/sitejoom/index.php/wiki/84-wiki/codetyphon-studio/72-codetyphon-about)** > > Pascal Visual Programming Studio Personally I feel Pascal is more cleaner and easy to learn compared to languages based in C like JAVA. TIA Yogi Yang ---
**Author:** ![thorstenstueker](https://ifnotnil.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/t/aca169/32.png) [@thorstenstueker](https://ifnotnil.com/u/thorstenstueker)\ **Post date:** [1 November 2022 08:50 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/125 "2022-11-01T08:50:27Z")
While there is nearly no development of free pascal compared to java. Ant it has tons of bugs. ---
**Author:** ![bkeeney](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/bkeeney/32/225_2.png) [@bkeeney](https://ifnotnil.com/u/bkeeney)\ **Post date:** [1 November 2022 12:48 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/126 "2022-11-01T12:48:31Z")
I will be checking out Wails. [https://wails.io](https://wails.io). Cross platform Go development with React front end. Our Go architect has used it recently and was happy with the results. ---
**Author:** ![Jeannot](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/jeannot/32/3787_2.png) [@Jeannot](https://ifnotnil.com/u/Jeannot)\ **Post date:** [1 November 2022 13:30 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/127 "2022-11-01T13:30:26Z")
Yes it is great. FWIW, very small correction, it is not react only, I’m playing around with vue3 for instance. It is basically a kind of electron for go but more lightweight. Though I still hope that [https://fyne.io/](https://fyne.io/) will evolve more and more. It is not bad at all, but still missing a lot compared to the web frameworks you can embed into [wails.io](http://wails.io). [Fyne.io](http://Fyne.io) on the other hand has a few promising “add-ons” like a layout manager [https://github.com/fyne-io/defyne](https://github.com/fyne-io/defyne) but they aren’t too good in promoting those. ---
**Author:** ![YogiYang](https://ifnotnil.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/y/ecccb3/32.png) [@YogiYang](https://ifnotnil.com/u/YogiYang)\ **Post date:** [2 November 2022 07:43 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/128 "2022-11-02T07:43:37Z")
Hello, > [@thorstenstueker](#): > > Ant it has tons of bugs Have come across a very few bugs when compared to Xojo and its IDE is way more stable also! ---
**Author:** ![thorstenstueker](https://ifnotnil.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/t/aca169/32.png) [@thorstenstueker](https://ifnotnil.com/u/thorstenstueker)\ **Post date:** [2 November 2022 08:48 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/129 "2022-11-02T08:48:33Z")
Please compare to java, c++ or c or c# and the ide with intellij, vs, eclipse. We wanna speak about professional grade behavior. Lazarus development is slow but it’s free software. Xojo had all the money needed. ---
**Author:** ![Torsten\_B](https://ifnotnil.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/t/ecae2f/32.png) [@Torsten\_B](https://ifnotnil.com/u/Torsten_B)\ **Post date:** [27 November 2022 17:32 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/130 "2022-11-27T17:32:26Z")
I am taking [appsmith](https://www.appsmith.com) for a spin this weekend. It is a new, recently launched platform. The IDE is a web app and it creates web apps. The community edition is open source. There is a free cloud offer and lokal installation (using Docker). It is work in progress and evolves quite fast. [GitHub counts 220 contributors](https://github.com/appsmithorg/appsmith). ---
**Author:** ![dalu](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/dalu/32/1776_2.png) [@dalu](https://ifnotnil.com/u/dalu)\ **Post date:** [28 November 2022 03:02 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/131 "2022-11-28T03:02:30Z")
!!! looks very nice to acess apis 🙂 but didn’t see any live examples, and you’re putting something online your self this looks interesting , thanks ---
**Author:** ![XojoPro](https://ifnotnil.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/x/eb8c5e/32.png) [@XojoPro](https://ifnotnil.com/u/XojoPro)\ **Post date:** [28 November 2022 14:18 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/132 "2022-11-28T14:18:15Z")
LiveCode have a decent Black Friday deal on until midnight today if anyone wants to give it a spin - warning - it is an entirely different development process and the language is “different”. It is however extremely capable, well supported, and rapidly developing. ![image](https://ifnotnil.com/uploads/default/original/2X/4/4b6e350aa6c0402056342138539aea9e7aa67feb.png) ---
**Author:** ![bgrommes](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/bgrommes/32/2651_2.png) [@bgrommes](https://ifnotnil.com/u/bgrommes)\ **Post date:** [28 November 2022 16:13 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/133 "2022-11-28T16:13:29Z")
Isn’t that the one whose ultimate ancestor is HyperCard? ---
**Author:** ![npalardy](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/npalardy/32/10_2.png) [@npalardy](https://ifnotnil.com/u/npalardy)\ **Post date:** [28 November 2022 16:41 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/134 "2022-11-28T16:41:49Z")
In spirit at least I think LiveCode descends from a similar product - MetaCard - which was also inspired by Hypercard (along with SuperCard) ---
**Author:** ![XojoPro](https://ifnotnil.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/x/eb8c5e/32.png) [@XojoPro](https://ifnotnil.com/u/XojoPro)\ **Post date:** [28 November 2022 16:42 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/135 "2022-11-28T16:42:30Z")
It is indeed - a distant relative now mind. My biggest gripe with it is the editor - it makes Xojo look world class to be honest. ---
**Author:** ![dickey](https://ifnotnil.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/d/958977/32.png) [@dickey](https://ifnotnil.com/u/dickey)\ **Post date:** [28 November 2022 22:25 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/136 "2022-11-28T22:25:56Z")
@XojoPro, Concerns noted, however there are plenty of alternative editors / frameworks for LiveCode. You can use Atom, Sublime Text etc among other editors, a framework called GLX2 [https://github.com/mwieder/glx2ScriptEditor](https://github.com/mwieder/glx2ScriptEditor) . Just dig around the forum, for the latest alternatives. I had booked marked this from 2020 [Is there a alternative code editor to Livecode's built-in one? - LiveCode Forums](https://forums.livecode.com/viewtopic.php?t=34009) Team LiveCode are working on a new web-based IDE, which I expect will be a quantum leap forward in respect of the capabilities of the current editor. Kind regards, Andrew ---
**Author:** ![XojoPro](https://ifnotnil.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/x/eb8c5e/32.png) [@XojoPro](https://ifnotnil.com/u/XojoPro)\ **Post date:** [28 November 2022 22:54 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/137 "2022-11-28T22:54:14Z")
Interesting - thanks. ---
**Author:** ![stam](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/stam/32/453_2.png) [@stam](https://ifnotnil.com/u/stam)\ **Post date:** [19 February 2023 18:04 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/138 "2023-02-19T18:04:55Z")
The new IDE currently in development is worlds apart and will be on par with any modern IDE judging by the demos. Having said that it’s not materialised yet… but it’s definitely happening (seems likely this year). Not sure it will add that much to those already experienced in LC but definitely looks more familiar if you’re used to XCode for example…. ---
**Author:** ![DaveDuke](https://ifnotnil.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/d/8e8cbc/32.png) [@DaveDuke](https://ifnotnil.com/u/DaveDuke)\ **Post date:** [14 March 2023 15:04 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/139 "2023-03-14T15:04:18Z")
I worked as a developer and managed technical support people for this company for many years. It is very much like Xojo for Unix then (was character based dbase before then) , but unless they changed, there was a stiff runtime cost per end user. Although Barry who wrote the code must also be getting on. ---
**Author:** ![bgrommes](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/bgrommes/32/2651_2.png) [@bgrommes](https://ifnotnil.com/u/bgrommes)\ **Post date:** [14 March 2023 16:46 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/140 "2023-03-14T16:46:25Z")
> [@DaveDuke](#): > > Although Barry who wrote the code must also be getting on. So many of these projects / products are sustained by the passion / vision of one or two people who have flogged it for years and not gotten it out of niche territory, and have no succession plan. I can personally testify that the lack of a succession plan is no small thing even if the product is out of niche territory. That was the saga of my last client. When the owner was getting wobbly / senile they sold the whole thing right out from under me, to the highest bidder, and they just gutted everything and discarded it. I’ve rebooted with another client and believe me I have a clause in the contract where I get 10% of the sale price if they try that crap again. ---
**Author:** ![TomasJ](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/tomasj/32/4998_2.png) [@TomasJ](https://ifnotnil.com/u/TomasJ)\ **Post date:** [16 March 2023 05:53 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416/141 "2023-03-16T05:53:34Z")
if GTK - no problems at all. Try PDFArranger > **[GitHub - pdfarranger/pdfarranger: Small python-gtk application, which helps...](https://github.com/pdfarranger/pdfarranger)** > > Small python-gtk application, which helps the user to merge or split PDF documents and rotate, crop and rearrange their pages using an interactive and intuitive graphical interface. - GitHub - pdfa... on Window it’s 1:1 like in Linux [Previous page](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416.md?page=6) [Next page](https://ifnotnil.com/t/moving-away-from-xojo/2416.md?page=8)