# A positive rant? **URL:** \ **Category:** Other\ **Created:** [7 September 2020 21:13 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931 "2020-09-07T21:13:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![bkeeney](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/bkeeney/32/225_2.png) [@bkeeney](https://ifnotnil.com/u/bkeeney)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 15:25 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/21 "2020-09-08T15:25:09Z")
Nope. They ‘fixed’ the error in the R1.1 build but doesn’t do shit for us. This crash happens in 2019 R2.1 so we’ll be lucky if it ever gets fixed. ---
**Author:** ![DaveS](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/daves/32/79_2.png) [@DaveS](https://ifnotnil.com/u/DaveS)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 15:30 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/22 "2020-09-08T15:30:22Z")
> [@bkeeney](#): > > and I couldn’t respond. couldn’t as in you felt it would be inappropriate? or couldn’t as you no longer are “allowed” to by Xojo? ---
**Author:** ![bkeeney](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/bkeeney/32/225_2.png) [@bkeeney](https://ifnotnil.com/u/bkeeney)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 15:32 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/23 "2020-09-08T15:32:50Z")
The thread is locked now so I couldn’t respond. But it’s giving me fodder for the blog so it’s good. ---
**Author:** ![npalardy](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/npalardy/32/10_2.png) [@npalardy](https://ifnotnil.com/u/npalardy)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 16:36 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/24 "2020-09-08T16:36:50Z")
That such a rant thread attracted as many posts as it did should say “something” Good or bad as there seemed to be posts that were on both sides ---
**Author:** ![TomasJ](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/tomasj/32/4998_2.png) [@TomasJ](https://ifnotnil.com/u/TomasJ)\ **Post date:** [9 September 2020 08:33 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/25 "2020-09-09T08:33:32Z")
> [@npalardy](#): > > That such a rant thread attracted as many posts as it did should say “something” yup, like in real life. If you encounter anywhere in the wildlife a pile of household rubbish you may see how everybody starts to add or unlaod his/her rubbish there too. ---
**Author:** ![samRowlands](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/samrowlands/32/121_2.png) [@samRowlands](https://ifnotnil.com/u/samRowlands)\ **Post date:** [9 September 2020 09:02 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/26 "2020-09-09T09:02:34Z")
Let us know when you post it. ---
**Author:** ![samRowlands](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/samrowlands/32/121_2.png) [@samRowlands](https://ifnotnil.com/u/samRowlands)\ **Post date:** [9 September 2020 09:11 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/27 "2020-09-09T09:11:57Z")
This whole thing has gotten me thinking. If you use a different lens to look at the situation, it’s an incredible market research opportunity. You’ve got people literally willing to throw money at your company, but there’s valid reasons as to why these customers feel their last resort is to rant and whine. Send all the people who’ve contributed to that thread a questionnaire (maybe even a discount coupon too). Collect all the results and sift through them, looking to find common causes, then set-about devising a plan to solve as many of these complaints as possible. Having enough evidence helps isolate the root cause of a bunch of symptoms, and sometimes it’s much easier to solve the root cause than patch a symptom. Reach out and interact with these customers, try to understand and solve their gripes and they’ll do the marketing for you. ---
**Author:** ![MonkeybreadSoftware](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/monkeybreadsoftware/32/451_2.png) [@MonkeybreadSoftware](https://ifnotnil.com/u/MonkeybreadSoftware)\ **Post date:** [9 September 2020 09:29 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/28 "2020-09-09T09:29:49Z")
Xojo Inc. has big clients. Those depend on the product and would certainly be happy to invest into the company, providing the money could be spend on more staff to get things working out better. e.g. make sure you have 2 for each target and e.g. 2 for compiler/linker things. ---
**Author:** ![MarkusWinter](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/markuswinter/32/32_2.png) [@MarkusWinter](https://ifnotnil.com/u/MarkusWinter)\ **Post date:** [9 September 2020 09:39 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/29 "2020-09-09T09:39:00Z")
Thomas Tempelmann’s post on using autodiscovery: ![autodiscovery](https://ifnotnil.com/uploads/default/original/1X/7f231e08371e5a9ee82e9e1829c6c1606c2fe3ac.png) Don’t you just LOVE Germans … 😉 from [https://forum.xojo.com/t/how-to-communicate-the-port-for-autodiscovery/56822/27](https://forum.xojo.com/t/how-to-communicate-the-port-for-autodiscovery/56822/27) ---
**Author:** ![samRowlands](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/samrowlands/32/121_2.png) [@samRowlands](https://ifnotnil.com/u/samRowlands)\ **Post date:** [9 September 2020 10:25 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/30 "2020-09-09T10:25:21Z")
I suspect it won’t be long before that gets shut down in some way. Good read though. ---
**Author:** ![MarkusWinter](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/markuswinter/32/32_2.png) [@MarkusWinter](https://ifnotnil.com/u/MarkusWinter)\ **Post date:** [9 September 2020 10:35 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/31 "2020-09-09T10:35:49Z")
🍿 🍿 🍿 Very good read! ![autodiscovery 2](https://ifnotnil.com/uploads/default/original/1X/6b16f42fa6f4050ac7556a4fdb21313fadacfea0.png) ---
**Author:** ![ivan](https://ifnotnil.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/i/df788c/32.png) [@ivan](https://ifnotnil.com/u/ivan)\ **Post date:** [9 September 2020 13:42 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/32 "2020-09-09T13:42:19Z")
> [@samRowlands](#): > > Having enough evidence helps isolate the root cause of a bunch of symptoms, and sometimes it’s much easier to solve the root cause than patch a symptom. Any opportunity for improvement is useless if the person in charge continues in a state of denial for any of the the symptoms. ---
**Author:** ![beatrixwillius](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/beatrixwillius/32/24_2.png) [@beatrixwillius](https://ifnotnil.com/u/beatrixwillius)\ **Post date:** [9 September 2020 13:52 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/33 "2020-09-09T13:52:00Z")
There will be no change until either Geoff retires or Xojo has to do Chapter 11. ---
**Author:** ![npalardy](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/npalardy/32/10_2.png) [@npalardy](https://ifnotnil.com/u/npalardy)\ **Post date:** [9 September 2020 14:01 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/34 "2020-09-09T14:01:28Z")
I’d tend to agree there is an opportunity here I have my doubts they’ll take it They could / should have been doing “exit interviews” with users as well - for many of the same reasons If a user didnt renew their license they could follow up and see why A lot will likely be “I cant afford a renewal” or “I no longer need it” But there will be others though, that give them feedback that is useful To my knowledge they have never done this and so dont really know why people do not renew - just that they dont. ---
**Author:** ![anic297](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/anic297/32/18_2.png) [@anic297](https://ifnotnil.com/u/anic297)\ **Post date:** [9 September 2020 16:14 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/35 "2020-09-09T16:14:13Z")
I’m hoping and guessing it’s still possible that Xojo is just in a bad period these days/months, like having spent too much in wrong directions (testing ways) and will still be able to see what they did wrong and recover from that. For instance, I have the feeling mentioning other tools on the official forum has ceased (decreased, at least) to be censored. They may not publicly acknowledge mistakes, but it’s still possible they are somehow aware of [some of] them and try to rectify. And since rectifying implies making a mistake in the first place, the time to notice, eventually recognise and finally mitigate the thoughts, this can take some times (especially when you don’t want people to see you changed your mind, this has to be a lengthy process); we probably are seeing much more easily the moments where mistakes aren’t yet addressed. I can’t and won’t think this is impossible. My positive rant to stay on topic 😁 ---
**Author:** ![npalardy](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/npalardy/32/10_2.png) [@npalardy](https://ifnotnil.com/u/npalardy)\ **Post date:** [9 September 2020 17:13 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/36 "2020-09-09T17:13:14Z")
> [@anic297](#): > > For instance, I have the feeling mentioning other tools on the official forum has ceased (decreased, at least) to be censored. Beat a dog long enough for “bad behaviour” they usually start to obey and just dont do the bad behaviour. Some learn YOU are bad and start to bite back > [@anic297](#): > > They may not publicly acknowledge mistakes, but it’s still possible they are somehow aware of [some of] them and try to rectify. Very sure they know this > [@anic297](#): > > I can’t and won’t think this is impossible. Had this been my first experience with such a thing - maybe Now I’m not so sure All I can say is “we’ll see wont we?” I’m hedging my bets ---
**Author:** ![DaveS](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/daves/32/79_2.png) [@DaveS](https://ifnotnil.com/u/DaveS)\ **Post date:** [9 September 2020 17:14 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/37 "2020-09-09T17:14:45Z")
> [@npalardy](#): > > Beat a dog long enough for “bad behaviour” they usually start to obey and just dont do the bad behaviour. Or Xojo just shoots the dog (ie. bans the user) ---
**Author:** ![bkeeney](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/bkeeney/32/225_2.png) [@bkeeney](https://ifnotnil.com/u/bkeeney)\ **Post date:** [9 September 2020 17:54 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/38 "2020-09-09T17:54:33Z")
Ya know, I’ve been having this _exact_ conversation for about 15 years. Part of the reason why I helped found ARBP to try and get the “pro’s” together and tell Xojo what we needed. Lot of work and no pay off. I’ve blogged ad nauseam. I’ve had conversations with various Xojo employees and the CEO. I’ve had more conversations that I ever care to admit. At the end of the day the direction of the company is set by the CEO and if he’s not willing to change direction then we will. I’ve become disgusted by the direction taken and the arrogance taken towards the long-time users. It’s almost as if they don’t want us as customers. ---
**Author:** ![samRowlands](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/samrowlands/32/121_2.png) [@samRowlands](https://ifnotnil.com/u/samRowlands)\ **Post date:** [10 September 2020 01:47 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/39 "2020-09-10T01:47:52Z")
> [@bkeeney](#): > > It’s almost as if they don’t want us as customers. It’s a feeling that’s shared by several “Pro” developers I’ve spoken with recently. ---
**Author:** ![npalardy](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/npalardy/32/10_2.png) [@npalardy](https://ifnotnil.com/u/npalardy)\ **Post date:** [10 September 2020 02:16 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/40 "2020-09-10T02:16:24Z")
> [@bkeeney](#): > > I’ve become disgusted by the direction taken and the arrogance taken towards the long-time users. It’s almost as if they don’t want us as customers. I dont know if its arrogance towards long term users or apathy towards them ? Either way long term users, who are often also full time developers, feel like we’re along for the ride but have to sit in the back of the bus where the driver cannot hear us. Xojo likes to put “our” wares on display (see " What others are making with Xojo" on [Xojo.com](http://Xojo.com) or here [Xojo: Xojo Programming: Example Apps](https://www.xojo.com/resources/examples.php)) Some of the people bitching moaning and whining ARE those developers Xojo likes to show off and say “See what YOU can do too !” Guys who have PUBLICLY said “not using it any more” like Tim Dietrich are still showcased (odd isnt it?) [Previous page](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931.md?page=1) [Next page](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931.md?page=3)