# A positive rant? **URL:** \ **Category:** Other\ **Created:** [7 September 2020 21:13 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931 "2020-09-07T21:13:19Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![MarkusWinter](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/markuswinter/32/32_2.png) [@MarkusWinter](https://ifnotnil.com/u/MarkusWinter)\ **Post date:** [7 September 2020 21:13 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/1 "2020-09-07T21:13:20Z")
> **[Xojo for rant](https://forum.xojo.com/t/xojo-for-rant/56790/12)** > > I’m writing this while being totally calm, so don’t mistake it for a rant: What do you do if you see a product you love go downhill because the focus moved from quality releases to a „NEW FEATURES” PR driven model? Not even you can claim that iOS... ---
**Author:** ![ivan](https://ifnotnil.com/letter_avatar_proxy/v4/letter/i/df788c/32.png) [@ivan](https://ifnotnil.com/u/ivan)\ **Post date:** [7 September 2020 21:43 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/2 "2020-09-07T21:43:27Z")
Not sure if it is going to last there, but Markus words are: > I wish Xojo well. I want them to succeed. But I also see where this ship is heading, and the captain ignoring the advice and warnings of the most knowledgeable people and instead insisting that nobody tells him how to run his ship when he is heading for an iceberg … well, what do you do then? > > ``` > Say that shouting doesn’t help? > > It’s all you have left before jumping ship. > > ``` Place your bets!! How many centuries will markus be banned? 🤣 ---
**Author:** ![npalardy](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/npalardy/32/10_2.png) [@npalardy](https://ifnotnil.com/u/npalardy)\ **Post date:** [7 September 2020 22:01 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/3 "2020-09-07T22:01:45Z")
I put my money on Zero 🙂 My ban is almost certainly a personal thing EDIT : However Ivan your post back to Geoff about his “dont tell me how to run my company” post might get YOU banned 😛 Man I wish I could find that one - although as you noted over there its possible it has since been removed as its a pretty shitty post for a CEO to make (true or not) ---
**Author:** ![npalardy](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/npalardy/32/10_2.png) [@npalardy](https://ifnotnil.com/u/npalardy)\ **Post date:** [7 September 2020 23:56 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/4 "2020-09-07T23:56:08Z")
That entire thread gets more entertaining to read every time geoff replies ! ---
**Author:** ![DaveS](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/daves/32/79_2.png) [@DaveS](https://ifnotnil.com/u/DaveS)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 00:09 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/5 "2020-09-08T00:09:04Z")
My ban was for pointing out publicly how arrogant Geoff is (as further evidenced by that topic). And for the record… I too read the past post where he said “Don’t tell me how to run my company”… So those replies where he is denying it are pure “BS” (and I don’t mean BigSur) ---
**Author:** ![npalardy](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/npalardy/32/10_2.png) [@npalardy](https://ifnotnil.com/u/npalardy)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 00:11 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/6 "2020-09-08T00:11:07Z")
I cant say I saw such a reply, but that doesnt mean it doesnt / didnt exist. Several people have said they saw such a post and they cant all be hallucinating. I wouldnt be surprised he made such a comment in the least. I’m sure there are others that would say that as well. ---
**Author:** ![MarkusWinter](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/markuswinter/32/32_2.png) [@MarkusWinter](https://ifnotnil.com/u/MarkusWinter)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 00:19 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/7 "2020-09-08T00:19:43Z")
> [@ivan](#): > > How many centuries will markus be banned? I think I might now be on course for 10,000 … 🙄 ---
**Author:** ![DaveS](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/daves/32/79_2.png) [@DaveS](https://ifnotnil.com/u/DaveS)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 00:29 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/8 "2020-09-08T00:29:17Z")
I am amazed that Geoff hasn’t tried to rationalize your forum user chart away. ---
**Author:** ![eugenedakin](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/eugenedakin/32/3892_2.png) [@eugenedakin](https://ifnotnil.com/u/eugenedakin)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 01:04 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/9 "2020-09-08T01:04:40Z")
Should a copy of the topic be made before it is deleted? 🙂 Or does it matter? ---
**Author:** ![DaveS](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/daves/32/79_2.png) [@DaveS](https://ifnotnil.com/u/DaveS)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 01:07 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/10 "2020-09-08T01:07:19Z")
best hurry… I doubt it will be there much longer ---
**Author:** ![samRowlands](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/samrowlands/32/121_2.png) [@samRowlands](https://ifnotnil.com/u/samRowlands)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 01:16 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/11 "2020-09-08T01:16:53Z")
Calm down over there mate. You make some really good points, but it feels like you’re testing their limits. ---
**Author:** ![MarkusWinter](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/markuswinter/32/32_2.png) [@MarkusWinter](https://ifnotnil.com/u/MarkusWinter)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 01:24 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/12 "2020-09-08T01:24:50Z")
Weeell, they are shooting themselves in the foot - I just point it out. > Bob is still here > WHAT? Tim & Hal have left??? > 1000 years is just Discourse doing it’s thing. and my personal favourite: > If you can find it, I’d like to see that ---
**Author:** ![DaveS](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/daves/32/79_2.png) [@DaveS](https://ifnotnil.com/u/DaveS)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 01:26 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/13 "2020-09-08T01:26:43Z")
`It is also important to remember that the majority of users don’t spend a lot of time on the support forum so voices here are not always representative of the entire user base.` Geoff… might want to take a class on Statistic Sampling… however you would be correct that more negative responses are more likely to be posted… but that doesn’t make them any less representaive of the entire client population. They will also be voiced by those people that “care” (or did), as opposed to those that either don’t care or dont’ know. And remember also, just because you have sold “X” copies of Xojo doesn’t mean you have “X” ACTIVE USERS… ---
**Author:** ![DaveS](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/daves/32/79_2.png) [@DaveS](https://ifnotnil.com/u/DaveS)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 01:35 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/14 "2020-09-08T01:35:41Z")
> [@MarkusWinter](#): > > If you can find it, I’d like to see that along with the implied “, and you won’t, because we already deleted it as “fake news”” ---
**Author:** ![beatrixwillius](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/beatrixwillius/32/24_2.png) [@beatrixwillius](https://ifnotnil.com/u/beatrixwillius)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 07:42 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/15 "2020-09-08T07:42:33Z")
It’s so entertaining to read Geoffs replies. ---
**Author:** ![TomasJ](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/tomasj/32/4998_2.png) [@TomasJ](https://ifnotnil.com/u/TomasJ)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 08:52 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/16 "2020-09-08T08:52:16Z")
I would like to second Sam: Please calm it down… stay focused on real issues and facts ---
**Author:** ![Alwaysbusy](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/alwaysbusy/32/894_2.png) [@Alwaysbusy](https://ifnotnil.com/u/Alwaysbusy)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 10:47 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/17 "2020-09-08T10:47:29Z")
Agreed. no need to provoke. I could as well written my story there, but I decided this is a much friendlier place to do so 😉 One thing I couldn’t help but notice was, besides the ‘all hands on deck’ call of the Stormtroopers, the naivety of the new and ‘potential’ users of Xojo. This was something I recall being myself. At first, everything looks very bright, shiny and perfect. I remember showing RB off to my bosses and they also were very impressed (we are talking 2007 here). We decided this was the tool to build the company on and made our first major client program. I must admit, this year long project went rather smooth. We did have to write workarounds for bugs, but the promises to fix them looked very legit and there was no doubt in our minds at all. We started our next even bigger project, and with what we have learned from the previous one, we had quite the library of ‘fixes’ we could rely on. A bit disappointed we still had to use it, but hey, those guys are working on it they said. Years went by and the pile of bugs became bigger and bigger instead of decreasing. I still was convinced (RB, then RealStudio and later Xojo) would do the _right_ thing and keep up with their promises. It became however more and more difficult to convince my colleagues of it. It went so far it actually became a real issue within the company. As I stood alone, I became angry. First at my company for losing the faith, but very quickly I became aware I was actually angry with Xojo. Why the deceives? Why the promises? Why aren’t those guys fixing and testing their stuff? How can they release such buggy tools release after release for the big part of a decade? So we moved on. I’m telling my story because I recognize so much of it in that post on their forum. From being happy and in awe at first as a newbie, over learning to live with the problems it has, to getting full angry and disappointed. It is a timeline every Xojo user seems to have to follow. And that can’t be right, no? ---
**Author:** ![MarkusWinter](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/markuswinter/32/32_2.png) [@MarkusWinter](https://ifnotnil.com/u/MarkusWinter)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 15:10 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/18 "2020-09-08T15:10:34Z")
Aaaand it’s locked. By the usual suspects. 🙄 … and it’s not the beginning of a beautiful friendship … ---
**Author:** ![bkeeney](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/bkeeney/32/225_2.png) [@bkeeney](https://ifnotnil.com/u/bkeeney)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 15:18 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/19 "2020-09-08T15:18:59Z")
Sigh. My name was brought up several times and I couldn’t respond. My response would have not have been very kind to Xojo. In my new position I am still using Xojo. We’ve been using 2019 R1.1 and there are some really nice bug fixes and features we _need_ in 2020 R1. But our app crashes in Windows almost immediately. I’ve been working with Xojo to try and figure it out but my first impulse is to ask, “We’ve waited a year and a half for this shite?” Works great on Mac but for everything else you’re rolling the dice as to what’s broken. In my long time in the community I’ve seen the number of targets expand dramatically and the number of developers go down. Rather than making what they have great it certainly appears as if they’re intent on making all targets mediocre and thus forcing all of those using Xojo for their commercial products to abandon the product. We (meaning most of us here) just can’t live with a crap product that’s not addressing our needs. We love the product but not in the direction it’s going. ---
**Author:** ![MarkusWinter](https://ifnotnil.com/user_avatar/ifnotnil.com/markuswinter/32/32_2.png) [@MarkusWinter](https://ifnotnil.com/u/MarkusWinter)\ **Post date:** [8 September 2020 15:21 UTC](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931/20 "2020-09-08T15:21:37Z")
> [@bkeeney](#): > > But our app crashes in Windows almost immediately Yikes. Any idea why? [Next page](https://ifnotnil.com/t/a-positive-rant/931.md?page=2)